Planning for next season

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Phil LUFC
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 12:26 pm
Location: Scunthorpe

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Phil LUFC » Tue May 21, 2019 11:20 am

Yeboah wrote:
You need to remember that he came from City on a free so his current salary will be inflated due to ‘no fee’.

Liverpool can’t roll him on to a lower value contract as I understand the rules. They’d need to release then re-sign. I don’t think they will pay an increasingly bit part player 80k per week either. What he got is irrelevant it’s what he can get and maybe where he wants to live.

Cellino did a good job on costs and was realistic with money. The state of the club at the time was one of the main reasons Radz bought in.

The alternative to MB is Hughton....who would cost less, much less as an overall package.

Depends what the club thinks, you could sell Bamford to fund Milner for 2 years if there is a genuine belief that he’s the man. Promote Edmondson to first team with Roofe or get a ‘Pukki’ from abroad.


I'm intrigued by the first bit, what rules would prevent a new contract offer being lower than the old one? Lukey Millions took a pay cut for a longer deal a few years back and the club made it known publicly.

Fair point on him moving on a free but.. it's the same situation this summer so it still plays into his hands. I think a large part of his market value is the home grown quota, there's still relatively few proven players who meet the criteria. You'd think at least half the PL would be interested in him on the right terms (still more than we could sensibly offer).

I think the chance died last Wednesday but I'm going to hang on to that hope he'd almost be prepared to pay us just to finish his career as Leeds captain, because he's rich enough and still loves Leeds and because it's what I'd do in his shoes with £50m or so behind me.

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Oheddieeddie
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 1:35 pm
Location: Tacky with sweat and poisonous particulates.

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Oheddieeddie » Tue May 21, 2019 11:32 am

Vampire wrote:
Oheddieeddie wrote:
Yeboah wrote:
With my background I maybe have a different perspective.yadda yadda,

My first Leeds game was when I was 4. I know suffering....!


First he lets on he was once a scout, then a coach, then a player....

Now it turns out he was in the first team for his Leeds United debut when he was 4. Fuck me


Out of interest, do you have any issues or alternative viewpoints to the ones he is expressing on the thread?

BTW - sorted your use of the quotes function for you - no need to thank me.


Bit chippy that vamps, almost like when you gently tease Yeboah, It's you that's personally offended.

My alternative viewpoint? Well James Milner is probably the most professional footballer in English football bar none. He's not coming here on some romantic odyssey. That's not what motivates him, additionally there's no team outside the premier league top 2 that wouldn't take him.

Cheers for helping with the quotes.

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Blackwhite
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 1:07 am
Location: Arse end of nowhere

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Blackwhite » Tue May 21, 2019 11:49 am

Did somebody who thinks winning is all that matters really just suggest swapping Bielsa for Hughton?


Did that actually just happen?
You know, I'm sick of following my dreams, man. I'm just going to ask where they're going and hook up with 'em later.

Clacton white
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:19 am

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Clacton white » Tue May 21, 2019 12:03 pm

Quiffy wrote:dwight gayle's availability is getting a few sniffing the air. west brom don't want him back, it could be the wages, but surely if he was good enough (on and off the pitch) they'd want him. please no and i cannot see bielsa wanting him.

It is wages . He's on premises wages , reputed 120k weekly I think .WBA won't do that . Certainly good enough on pitch in this division.... They have parachute payment still so if THEY can't afford him..................

Clacton white
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:19 am

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Clacton white » Tue May 21, 2019 12:07 pm

Blackwhite wrote:Did somebody who thinks winning is all that matters really just suggest swapping Bielsa for Hughton?


Did that actually just happen?

Hughton will be snapped up before Leeds have anything to do with it ,if Bielsa doesn't stay . Prefer Bielsa by far myself .

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Blackwhite
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 1:07 am
Location: Arse end of nowhere

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Blackwhite » Tue May 21, 2019 12:46 pm

Not doubting that.


I'm doubting his chances of winning anything with this squad as being >Bielsa...
You know, I'm sick of following my dreams, man. I'm just going to ask where they're going and hook up with 'em later.

Yeboah
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:06 am

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Yeboah » Tue May 21, 2019 2:14 pm

Blackwhite wrote:Did somebody who thinks winning is all that matters really just suggest swapping Bielsa for Hughton?


Did that actually just happen?


Of the 4 clubs he’s managed.

2 he got promoted

1 got to play offs and lost

1 were a prem team and got relegated after he left.

So, in comparison to Bielsa

- he’s managed in PL, MB has not (West Ham turned him down)
- he’s got clubs promoted to EPL

In fact the only thing he has in common with him is losing in playoffs.

Plus I’m sure his salary would have been less than £3m.

Again all of these are just career facts.

Just because previous managers here have been awful doesn’t mean it’s Bielsas way or no way with this type of squad.

Yeboah
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:06 am

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Yeboah » Tue May 21, 2019 2:19 pm

@oheddieeddie

Didn’t know you knew him personally or what motivates him, or that you know others well enough to compare their statuses as pros.

Good to know.

On teams......

Chelsea
Spurs
Scum
Gooners
Wolves

At least...

Wouldn’t want him.

In fact the comment makes no sense on any level

Yeboah
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:06 am

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Yeboah » Tue May 21, 2019 2:47 pm

Phil LUFC wrote:
Yeboah wrote:
You need to remember that he came from City on a free so his current salary will be inflated due to ‘no fee’.

Liverpool can’t roll him on to a lower value contract as I understand the rules. They’d need to release then re-sign. I don’t think they will pay an increasingly bit part player 80k per week either. What he got is irrelevant it’s what he can get and maybe where he wants to live.

Cellino did a good job on costs and was realistic with money. The state of the club at the time was one of the main reasons Radz bought in.

The alternative to MB is Hughton....who would cost less, much less as an overall package.

Depends what the club thinks, you could sell Bamford to fund Milner for 2 years if there is a genuine belief that he’s the man. Promote Edmondson to first team with Roofe or get a ‘Pukki’ from abroad.


I'm intrigued by the first bit, what rules would prevent a new contract offer being lower than the old one? Lukey Millions took a pay cut for a longer deal a few years back and the club made it known publicly.

Fair point on him moving on a free but.. it's the same situation this summer so it still plays into his hands. I think a large part of his market value is the home grown quota, there's still relatively few proven players who meet the criteria. You'd think at least half the PL would be interested in him on the right terms (still more than we could sensibly offer).

I think the chance died last Wednesday but I'm going to hang on to that hope he'd almost be prepared to pay us just to finish his career as Leeds captain, because he's rich enough and still loves Leeds and because it's what I'd do in his shoes with £50m or so behind me.


I think the contract situation is semantics 99% of the time in the real world.....only an issue if a player is in demand.

But it used to be that if a club wanted to extend a current contract I.e. no new contract then it had to be on the same or improved terms as the old one.

If not then the contract had to be ripped up and a new one drawn up.

So in JM case, I assume he wouldn’t be on the ‘retained’ list for the dippers as that would mean extension. So they’d have to release and then start again at a mutually agreed figure (lower). Of course once he’s ‘not retained’ another epl club can officially offer a different deal..

Of course it may be all different these days.... with Murph....not sure but a play can agree to rip it up and start again I guess assuming no one else is in for him or he benefits from it a different way.

The difference between now and when he left City is just his age and miles on the clock. He’s been playing at a high level for half his life.

Do you take a view that he’s bombproof or that wear and tear will catch up with him?

I’m sure Leeds could put a deal together for him to make him at least look. He’s at the stage where he’ll be considering post playing stuff.

Residence, kids schooling, coaching that type of stuff. You could also load the contract with a massive promotion bonus...,as at that point it doesn’t matter.

Nice signing on fee, good wages, get him through his badges, offer him a coaching job as part of the deal etc.

Anything is possible.

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Blackwhite
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 1:07 am
Location: Arse end of nowhere

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Blackwhite » Tue May 21, 2019 2:50 pm

Barcodes: got a relegated PL squad back up. Whoop.
Brum: 4th was it? Loser.
Norwich: relegated. Worse than total failure?
Brighton: total failure (by a point) then total success, then total failure again (15th).



You're comparing that with one season of Bielsa and I hate to tell you, but that's statistically meaningless.
Even leaving aside your undoubted professional's opinion (sniggers).
You know, I'm sick of following my dreams, man. I'm just going to ask where they're going and hook up with 'em later.

Yeboah
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:06 am

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Yeboah » Tue May 21, 2019 2:54 pm

Blackwhite wrote:Barcodes: got a relegated PL squad back up. Whoop.
Brum: 4th was it? Loser.
Norwich: relegated. Worse than total failure?
Brighton: total failure (by a point) then total success, then total failure again (15th).



You're comparing that with one season of Bielsa and I hate to tell you, but that's statistically meaningless.
Even leaving aside your undoubted professional's opinion (sniggers).



Every day and twice on a Sunday.

Especially for the money.

Bielsa s record, for all he might be a genius, is poor he’s admitted as much himself.

Give me someone with form in the book, over a might be/never has been type all the time.

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Blackwhite
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 1:07 am
Location: Arse end of nowhere

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Blackwhite » Tue May 21, 2019 4:26 pm

Yeboah wrote:Give me someone with form in the book, over a might be/never has been type all the time.


So, Colin then?



Fucking hellfire. We want different things out of life, clearly.
Still think you'd be happier in SW6.
You know, I'm sick of following my dreams, man. I'm just going to ask where they're going and hook up with 'em later.

Yeboah
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:06 am

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Yeboah » Tue May 21, 2019 5:10 pm

Blackwhite wrote:
Yeboah wrote:Give me someone with form in the book, over a might be/never has been type all the time.


So, Colin then?

Fucking hellfire. We want different things out of life, clearly.
Still think you'd be happier in SW6.


To (Mis) quote an ex resident of Sw6, you’re a specialist in failure.

I want to win....losing is for people like you.

Colin with the right support .....and 10 years ago....yes, all day.

He’s effectively another Wilco in style

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Blackwhite
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 1:07 am
Location: Arse end of nowhere

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Blackwhite » Tue May 21, 2019 5:22 pm

Yeboah wrote:
Blackwhite wrote:
Yeboah wrote:Give me someone with form in the book, over a might be/never has been type all the time.


So, Colin then?

Fucking hellfire. We want different things out of life, clearly.
Still think you'd be happier in SW6.


To (Mis) quote an ex resident of Sw6, you’re a specialist in failure.

I want to win....losing is for people like you.

Colin with the right support .....and 10 years ago....yes, all day.

He’s effectively another Wilco in style


:mrgreen: scenes
You know, I'm sick of following my dreams, man. I'm just going to ask where they're going and hook up with 'em later.

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Devi
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 6:15 pm
Location: Crystal Palarse

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Devi » Tue May 21, 2019 5:24 pm

Yeboah wrote:Colin with the right support .....and 10 years ago....yes


Head asplode.
I like it. What is it?

Yeboah
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:06 am

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Yeboah » Tue May 21, 2019 5:58 pm

Do the Leeds fans on here actually want promotion or would they prefer Champ football played nicely in front of a great crowd, that ultimately ends in failure?

Genuine question.

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Phil LUFC
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 12:26 pm
Location: Scunthorpe

Re: Planning for next season

Postby Phil LUFC » Tue May 21, 2019 6:04 pm

Yeboah wrote:Do you take a view that he’s bombproof or that wear and tear will catch up with him?

On this bit, naturally I fully assume:
If he comes here, he'll be injured pre-season, out until March after 2 aborted come backs, be a bit shit for 2 months and ultimately retire earlier than he might have planned.
If he goes anywhere else he'll be playing at a high level until he's pushing 40.

On the rest:

Cheers, interesting insight on contracts and makes sense. I think I'd heard similar but more in context of players U23 and what had to be done to ensure the club is entitled to compensation, I thought out of contract players could speak to other clubs as soon as they entered the last 6 months (ie Ramsey with Juve). I guess in Murphy's situation it wasn't at the point of expiry, it was mid term so he could easily have said "no thanks, I'll see it out and move on".

Any deal for Milner coming here starts with the player being desperate to come, if he's taking the professional route, playing to his maximum for as long as possible, we've no chance. It's purely about the romantic notion. Interesting discussion to pass the time but pie in the sky ultimately.

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eric olthwaite
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 10:14 pm
Location: Over there, behind that bush

Re: Planning for next season

Postby eric olthwaite » Tue May 21, 2019 6:13 pm

You’ve got to hope Milner wins the European Cup. It’s only if he’s in a position to say, ‘That rounds things off nicely’ where we’d have the remotest chance of a sniff.

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dirty leeds
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:13 pm
Location: London

Re: Planning for next season

Postby dirty leeds » Tue May 21, 2019 6:34 pm

eric olthwaite wrote:You’ve got to hope Milner wins the European Cup. It’s only if he’s in a position to say, ‘That rounds things off nicely’ where we’d have the remotest chance of a sniff.


Yes and it's why I do hope they win it. Nowt against Spuds. They've played some fine football this season. Failures, though, obvs.

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dirty leeds
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:13 pm
Location: London

Re: Planning for next season

Postby dirty leeds » Tue May 21, 2019 6:36 pm

Yeboah wrote:Do the Leeds fans on here actually want promotion or would they prefer Champ football played nicely in front of a great crowd, that ultimately ends in failure?

Genuine question.


And it's a question that you would ask - because it's all black or white to you.
I want promotion and I want it by playing good football that clearly shows us as being the best team in the league.


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