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Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:04 am
by Andymac-47
I could have done with a few more raisins in my cereal this morning, just saying like......

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:09 am
by welshwhite
Oheddieeddie wrote:I assume that by the lack of traffic on this thread that everyone is happy. Finally


kennyb has gone to have a barbie with Brett. I'm waiting to see if his views on BPF have somehow mellowed.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:44 am
by dirty leeds
Or the bears give him chlamydia.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:54 am
by Tommy
It's sort of bewildering how routine these wins are this season, which feels different to previous years (though we are still of course only a couple of points better off than we were under Monk). Two things occurred to me in quick succession after the final whistle and I suspect they might prove to be true -

1. Norwich are going to win the league because of course they are.

2. I think this time we actually will finish in the top six. I'm sure a characteristically Leeds United blip is coming, possibly even before the year is out, but this time around I think our squad has enough in reserve to get us through. There are so many players waiting in the wings who actually can do a job if called upon and competition for most places is lively if not fierce. Almost every week we see someone deputising somewhere and not only do they do a good job, they're actually pushing for inclusion. Clarke and Shackleton already look fairly ripe and the bit part young'uns like Halme and Huffer have served their purpose. Then there are a host of players who could potentially yet force their way into contention if injuries and suspensions take their toll - Roberts, Bamford, Brown, Baker, Harrison, Pearce, Coyle, Dallas, Edmondson, Davis, Gotts, Stevens etc. I'm sure we'll bring in 2-3 players in January too (definitely a keeper, almost certainly a centre-half and possibly a winger). We'll no doubt have a dip in form at some point but I think all of the above will prove to be enough to stay above the 7th-10th place challengers.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:11 am
by Mustafaster
Tommy, we're bringing nobody in except a replacement for Blackman.
You just have to get your pretty little head around that simple fact and all will be well.
Bielsa is creating a culture, he would much rather use the players at his disposal, who understand the culture, than bring somebody else in who might not.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:20 am
by Tommy
I'm fine with bringing in nobody, in fact I actually like the idea, but I reckon his resolve could weaken in December.

We're reportedly on the verge of bringing in Keiren Westwood as our bench warmer until the Peacock is inevitably blamed for something else.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:21 am
by dirty leeds
Haven't seen anything of Norwich beyond extended highlights of our game with them and various goals. [Seen more of teams like Boro, WBA, Sheff U.] So no proper idea of how good they are. I guess the table speaks for itself. Anyone else have an opinion based on viewings? [Have they even been on TV much?]

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:43 am
by Ponte
dirty leeds wrote:Haven't seen anything of Norwich beyond extended highlights of our game with them and various goals. [Seen more of teams like Boro, WBA, Sheff U.] So no proper idea of how good they are. I guess the table speaks for itself. Anyone else have an opinion based on viewings? [Have they even been on TV much?]

According to the table they are slightly better than us. Boro and Sheff Utd were slightly better than us not long ago.
Just saying.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:46 am
by the flying pig
they seem to be very, uh, German.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:51 am
by Tommy
They've won twelve of their last fifteen and lost only once since September. The only reason they haven't opened an obscene gap is that they were slow off the blocks. I'd imagine they will have daylight between them and the rest of the league by the new year.

Bielsa is great, I wouldn't have any other manager at our club, but in typical Leeds fashion we've found the right man concurrently with one of our rivals also finding a very good manager in the shape of Farke. They have a handful of good players supplemented by a fairly deep squad and he has them humming. Frankly I don't really give a toss who wins the league, I'm just glad it almost certainly won't be Boro (though of course they have to be favourites for one of the three promotion places).

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:17 am
by dirty leeds
Ah yeah, I was hoping for some kind of breakdown on their players and how they set up/play... other than 'very productively'.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:47 am
by Quiffy
dirty leeds wrote:Ah yeah, I was hoping for some kind of breakdown on their players and how they set up/play... other than 'very productively'.

based on very little, i believe they're pragmatic, no pissing round at the back near their own goal, a few tacklers in the middle, the goals i've just looked at rely on defenders not marking their men in the box where they do seem to have good movement so the ones i saw were mostly from about 10 yards. they have an annoying habit of scoring winning goals in injury time, twice in 2 weeks.

obviously, like norwich itself there is no discernible style.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:25 pm
by eric olthwaite
They aren't all that and they won't stay the distance.

In my opinion.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:28 pm
by JimbobMaloney
eric olthwaite wrote:They aren't all that and they won't stay the distance.

In my opinion.


I thought that about Cardiff last season.

Just saying.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:09 pm
by Tommy
38 points from 45 available and winning matches in the 94th minute are the sort of things that, to me at least, suggest they're the real deal.

Hopefully I'm cursing them by saying this but recent history dictates that what could well prove to be our best season in a decade would have to be at least partially spoiled by a fairly nondescript side winning the league because Leeds.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 2:41 pm
by Phil LUFC
I expect Norwich will last the pace to be in the mix at least, as Tommy says, those 2 last minute winners in recent weeks speak volumes. But.. we comfortably beat them 3-0 at their place, no real notice was taken because they were still in the bottom half at the time.

I don't think they were shit back then but undoubtedly not firing as they are now. They're not Wolves by any stretch of the imagination and in the recent run there's not a lot in terms of standout results (they beat Villa buy before they started firing, Forest and Boro by a single goal each, drew with Derby).

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:06 pm
by eric olthwaite
You people are weird. Scoring twice in injury time tells you that they got lucky on the odd occasion when they were unable to win in 90. It’s not proof of some Godlike characteristic and it won’t happen often.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:15 pm
by SimonB
eric olthwaite wrote:You people are weird. Scoring twice in injury time tells you that they got lucky on the odd occasion when they were unable to win in 90. It’s not proof of some Godlike characteristic and it won’t happen often.


There is a bit more to it than that. Teams that score in the last few minutes tend, in my opinion, to be fitter than those who don't, tend to have a big more fight in them. Teams like that win.

Now of course these could be two flukes I didn't see the games so cant comment particularly on whether they were flukes or the result of hard work

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:29 pm
by Mustafaster
SimonB wrote:
eric olthwaite wrote:You people are weird. Scoring twice in injury time tells you that they got lucky on the odd occasion when they were unable to win in 90. It’s not proof of some Godlike characteristic and it won’t happen often.


There is a bit more to it than that. Teams that score in the last few minutes tend, in my opinion, to be fitter than those who don't, tend to have a big more fight in them. Teams like that win.

Now of course these could be two flukes I didn't see the games so cant comment particularly on whether they were flukes or the result of hard work

Aye. fluke goals can occur at any time in a match, from the first minute to the last.
There are very few fluke goals imo.
There are howlers from defenders and deflections, but those aren't flukes as a rule. Somebody has to be there to take advantage of a mistake. Pablo's goal at Blunts wasn't a fluke for example, the mistake was provoked by our players.
Yeboah's thunderbastards weren't flukes even though only 1 in 100 went in.
Getting late goals is a sign that teams keep fighting to the final whistle, have self belief and are fit. There's not much luck involved as a rule.

Re: Marcelo’s Sicknote Specials vs Stan Bowles was overrated CK

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 5:01 pm
by eric olthwaite
Mustafaster wrote:
SimonB wrote:
eric olthwaite wrote:You people are weird. Scoring twice in injury time tells you that they got lucky on the odd occasion when they were unable to win in 90. It’s not proof of some Godlike characteristic and it won’t happen often.


There is a bit more to it than that. Teams that score in the last few minutes tend, in my opinion, to be fitter than those who don't, tend to have a big more fight in them. Teams like that win.

Now of course these could be two flukes I didn't see the games so cant comment particularly on whether they were flukes or the result of hard work

Aye. fluke goals can occur at any time in a match, from the first minute to the last.
There are very few fluke goals imo.
There are howlers from defenders and deflections, but those aren't flukes as a rule. Somebody has to be there to take advantage of a mistake. Pablo's goal at Blunts wasn't a fluke for example, the mistake was provoked by our players.
Yeboah's thunderbastards weren't flukes even though only 1 in 100 went in.
Getting late goals is a sign that teams keep fighting to the final whistle, have self belief and are fit. There's not much luck involved as a rule.


I'm not talking about 'flukes'. The point is pretty straightforward I'd have thought. Every team / player scores X % of shots on target (no player or team is 100% successful at conversion, obviously). For the sake of the argument, let's say that chances are equally distributed over 90+ minutes. That means scoring twice in injury time is just a bit of a statistical anomaly, that's all.

Yeah, I know, simplification and there's something in the idea of a mindset about playing to the whistle and about being fit etc, but y'all still reading too much into it as A Thing.

Norwich haven't had a blip yet. They will. As far as I'm aware, they've not had critical injury issues yet either. They will.