YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

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rss1969
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby rss1969 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 2:44 pm

dirty leeds wrote:He didn't lose last time he got it.


:salute:

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dirty leeds
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:13 pm
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby dirty leeds » Fri Dec 13, 2019 2:50 pm

But he didn't win either...



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Quiffy
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Quiffy » Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:18 pm

i'm not sure it's cool to say, but that really doesn't matter to me, i'm such a big fanboy of marcelo that i actually want a picture with him. that would actually mean a lot to a middle aged yorkshireman. he is the nearest thing i have to a hero.

cue derision, because he hasn't won a lot from certain quarters. but i do find him inspiring. yes i have had a drink and am not normallly sentimental
increasing doubt, decreasing hope, even my imaginary friend went and changed his mind.

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Blackwhite
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Blackwhite » Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:27 pm

You're not wrong,Q.
You know, I'm sick of following my dreams, man. I'm just going to ask where they're going and hook up with 'em later.

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Quiffy
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Quiffy » Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:39 pm

Blackwhite wrote:You're not wrong,Q.

:thumbl: .
increasing doubt, decreasing hope, even my imaginary friend went and changed his mind.

JimbobMaloney
Joined: Thu May 03, 2012 3:18 pm

Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby JimbobMaloney » Fri Dec 13, 2019 8:10 pm

Now then. When I listened to the latest pod, one phrase got me thinking and I've been wondering about it since.
The guys were taking about the difference in the team from last season to this and the term 'let off the lead' poped up.
Dog puns aside, I've heard in several interviews that this was one of the Don's greatest regrets - that he didn't let the lads off the lead soon enough and that things could have been different if he had.
There seem to me to be huge similarities in some of the ways that Bielsa and the Don go about their business - the dossiers on opposition players and teams, the forging of team spirit, control of changes over the club.
Anyone else, or is it just me? I'm just Interested to hear opinions - especially from ballers who were around in those years. How long does Bielsa have to stay, how many trophies does he need to win, what win percentage does he need in order to be thought of in the same way people think of Revie?
Does anyone think he's up there already?

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Ponte
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Ponte » Fri Dec 13, 2019 9:12 pm

Quiffy wrote:i'm not sure it's cool to say, but that really doesn't matter to me, i'm such a big fanboy of marcelo that i actually want a picture with him. that would actually mean a lot to a middle aged yorkshireman. he is the nearest thing i have to a hero.

cue derision, because he hasn't won a lot from certain quarters. but i do find him inspiring. yes i have had a drink and am not normallly sentimental

I’m 42. I feel the same.
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Hmmm.

Son of Leeds
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Son of Leeds » Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:16 pm

I was there. I saw both Eddie goals live against Burnley. The chip was at my end in the kop.

Bielsa/Revie. Hmm. Difficult.

Temperamentally they are very different, though both perhaps OCD. Revie hated the way players were treated as serfs and did try to create what we'd now call a caring culture at the club, though that hardly applied to the opposition. Bielsa is decent, which couldn't be said of Revie, but whereas Revie made a Leeds family, Bielsa makes a machine. My take of Revie's Leeds is that he made a European club in England. Leeds probably played more European games than any other club at the time. His defenders could all attack: Hunter, Reaney and Cooper started as midfield players, and even Big Jack did a stint as centre forward. Bremner, defensive mid, started as a right winger, as did Giles. The emphasis upon technique throughout the team, and players interlinking, was Bielsa like. His training method was one and two touch football, and his team would have understood the Bielsa principle that if everyone moves around a little bit all thetime, no-one needs to move around a lot. I'd say that he was on a Bielsa track before Bielsa, but then statistical analysis took over in the 80s and English football took a completely different route, which led to dear ole WIlko. The dossier stuff is another obvious comparison, but ielsa is only doing more thoroughly what is common, whereas Revie's dossiers were regarded with general contempt by others, or with resentment. It was a way of stifling the beautiful game. It's interesting as a culture change that Bielsa's preparation is seen as a virtue when it was one of the things that Revie was hated for. Also, Revie was fascinated by formations. He invested the Manchester City deep lying centre forward. So, yes, the similarities have occurred to me before, but it's difficult to say we've found another Revie for a number of reasons. Bielsa coms at the end of his career, whereas Leeds was Revie's first job. Bielsa-ball overturned the counter-attacking philosophy, whereas Revie-ball used closing down as a way of suppressing the fixed formations: defenders defended and midfield players got the ball to the best attackers who tried to cause havoc. Revie was obsessed with winning, whereas I think Bielsa is honest when he says he reaches for 'the beauty of the game'. Revie was anxious and cautious, whereas Bielsa has complete conviction in dominating possession. But most of all, I think Revie never had any idea of moving from Leeds. He envisaged creating a club over his whole career. Bielsa leaves the overall management to others, which is inevitable these days, and once his experiments are over, he moves away. I think the similarities are accidental, in that there are overlaps, but fundamentally they are very different people and with idfferent ambitions. Revie developed football tactics because he wanted to win at Leeds. Bielsa develops tactics because it fascinates him and Leeds gives him to chance to test them in a new environment. Also, you could admire Revie, and follow him, but he was a difficult man to like, whereas Bielsa is nerdy-cute.
Leeds United is ruining my life.

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MightyWhite
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby MightyWhite » Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:19 pm

Ponte wrote:
Quiffy wrote:i'm not sure it's cool to say, but that really doesn't matter to me, i'm such a big fanboy of marcelo that i actually want a picture with him. that would actually mean a lot to a middle aged yorkshireman. he is the nearest thing i have to a hero.

cue derision, because he hasn't won a lot from certain quarters. but i do find him inspiring. yes i have had a drink and am not normallly sentimental

I’m 42. I feel the same.


It’s doable. We tend to drink on Granary Wharf fairly frequently pre-match and so I’ve been around when the squad come out of of the Doubletree to gets the bus to the ground and managed to get a snap with MB twice. Have a feeling they’ll be the sort of thing I’ll be cherishing for years to come.
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welshwhite
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby welshwhite » Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:11 am

Thank you Jimbob and SOL, very interesting reading those posts :thumbl:

For what it's worth the Don shades it for me, even though Bielsa has not brought any silverware here he's still fucking fantastic. His football is a joy to watch.

Even young Yebs is starting to rate him :cheers:

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Matt White
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:34 pm
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Matt White » Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:18 am

Son of Leeds wrote:Bielsa/Revie. Hmm. Difficult.


What a great post. I'm not taking the piss when I say that is a great answer to a hypothetical exam question. Discuss...

:salute:

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jackos
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 7:49 am
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby jackos » Sat Dec 14, 2019 8:00 am

Son of Leeds wrote: once his experiments are over, he moves away.


YOU TAKE THAT BACK :cry: :cry: MARCELO LOVES US :cry:

Great post SoL. :thumbl:

JimbobMaloney
Joined: Thu May 03, 2012 3:18 pm

Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby JimbobMaloney » Sat Dec 14, 2019 8:10 am

Cheers SoL, that's great reading - thanks for taking the time to write it

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Phil LUFC
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 12:26 pm
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Phil LUFC » Sat Dec 14, 2019 8:44 am

MightyWhite wrote:
Ponte wrote:
Quiffy wrote:i'm not sure it's cool to say, but that really doesn't matter to me, i'm such a big fanboy of marcelo that i actually want a picture with him. that would actually mean a lot to a middle aged yorkshireman. he is the nearest thing i have to a hero.

cue derision, because he hasn't won a lot from certain quarters. but i do find him inspiring. yes i have had a drink and am not normallly sentimental

I’m 42. I feel the same.


It’s doable. We tend to drink on Granary Wharf fairly frequently pre-match and so I’ve been around when the squad come out of of the Doubletree to gets the bus to the ground and managed to get a snap with MB twice. Have a feeling they’ll be the sort of thing I’ll be cherishing for years to come.

I shuck his hand and have a photo of him with the boy, delighted with that. Tried to deliver him a copy of that photo but in the end I have it to did security to pass on. We regret that now as we have no idea if he ever got it and want forever enough to put it address on the back of the frame. No other person has motivated us to want to do that in the first place. Susan saturating he should have asked for a selfie with everyone who asked him was maybe a factor as was Marcelo asking another young lads for a copy next game (in broken English).

What time to they tend to come out of the hotel? Got the boy a centenary ball for Xmas and want to try to get it signed, the hotel feels a better bet than post match waiting until the whether changes.

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dirty leeds
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby dirty leeds » Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:53 am

Son of Leeds wrote:Bielsa is decent, which couldn't be said of Revie... Also, you could admire Revie, and follow him, but he was a difficult man to like...


Interesting post, SoL. From it, these two assertions caught my eye. Why do you say the above? I was just a lad who lived in York at the time, but Don always struck me - from afar - as alright. Please explain.

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MightyWhite
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby MightyWhite » Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:30 am

What time to they tend to come out of the hotel? Got the boy a centenary ball for Xmas and want to try to get it signed, the hotel feels a better bet than post match waiting until the whether changes.


Usually about 2 hours before kickoff. If you get there for 12.30 you won’t go far wrong
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Bobbycollins
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Bobbycollins » Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:37 am

Excellent post from SoL. I'm actually older than Time itself and first starting watching Leeds in the late 1960s. Football has changed so much since Revie's time due mainly to the impact of Sky, such that comparisons are difficult. I don't recall the same intensity about the need for promotion, although this is probably fading memory and the fact that I didn't have 16 years of prior frustration. Formations are different - Revie always had 2 strikers, Peacock and Storrie; Jones and Clarke; Clarke and Jordan, whereas the lone striker under Bielsa occassionally causes me concern. I was never bothered if we went in a goal down at half-time under Revie, as I always thought he would produce some tactical change that would alter the outcome, however I don't think think Bielsa has the same quality of players or as many cards to play, notwithstanding the number of available subs.

I didn't care whether people disliked Revie - that was part of being Leeds. I'm extremely happy with Bielsa, both from a football viewpoint and the fact of him being humble. Bielsa isn't Revie and has no chance of achieving the same success at Leeds due to age and success now being largely cash-based. However we should all be very thankful that Bielsa is at Leeds - something that still fills me with amazement.

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Blackwhite
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby Blackwhite » Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:45 am

I was pleased in talking to an American (who follows English football) a couple of weeks back when he described us to another as somehow having one of the best managers in the world despite not being in the Big League. I mean on one level fuck him, but on another, fuck yeah.


Wasn't old enough/not yet Leeds for Revie, but this will do for me. Inspirational leadership.
You know, I'm sick of following my dreams, man. I'm just going to ask where they're going and hook up with 'em later.

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eric olthwaite
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby eric olthwaite » Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:26 am

JimbobMaloney wrote:Cheers SoL, that's great reading - thanks for taking the time to write it


Indeed.
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eric olthwaite
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Re: YES that Mad Bastard Bielsa's brand of football IS good enough for Leeds United

Postby eric olthwaite » Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:29 am

Ponte wrote:
Quiffy wrote:i'm not sure it's cool to say, but that really doesn't matter to me, i'm such a big fanboy of marcelo that i actually want a picture with him. that would actually mean a lot to a middle aged yorkshireman. he is the nearest thing i have to a hero.

cue derision, because he hasn't won a lot from certain quarters. but i do find him inspiring. yes i have had a drink and am not normallly sentimental

I’m 42. I feel the same.


I think the first time I saw him in person was QPR away, on there was definitely an OMG THAT’S HIM moment.
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